Transcript: BRN Grid Discussion #2 – The future of our World – Adult Verification

Transcript from the BRN Grid discussion #2 – The future of our World – Adult Verification From May 2nd 9am.

Thank you all who came, below is a transcript of the discussion thanks to Innula!

NOTE: I edited out some of the goodbyes :) As to shortern it, and Also put spaces between the lines as to make it easier to follow, if you would like a compressed version, contact me in SL,

– LilMatty Althouse
– BRN OWner

~~

LilMatty Althouse: hehe but one more minute then we will begin

LilMatty Althouse: Well everyone, are all fine to begin? :)

Darrin2101 Aeon: Yes-ah!

Trix Seetan: yep

Cynthia Darcy: yes

Debina DeSantis: yes

LilMatty Althouse: Well first of all I want to thank you all for coming!

Ezra Rasmuson: very well thanks Matty

LilMatty Althouse: its a great honor that you all respect the BRN enough to actually come! And I hope that some of the talk that happens here today will help you understand just a little about the changes coming to us all here in Second Life.

Ezra Rasmuson: lagging a little, Sunday in SL

LilMatty Althouse: The first topic of address is one of importance, and thats something that Innula an I have wanted to put forward for some time now. Which is the Future of the BRN with the adult changes coming.

Cynthia Darcy: hello q

Master Quatro: hello everyone

Master Quatro: am i sitting on anyone

Master Quatro: oops

LilMatty Althouse: Some of the changes the BRN is facing is on the Freedonia SIM, which host nearly all of our builders resources.

Trix Seetan: hi

Innula Zenovka: Hi, Master Quatro

LilMatty Althouse: Welcome M Quatro :) and Preo

Debina DeSantis: Greeting’s Master Quatro

Master Quatro: good to see you all

LilMatty Althouse: as I was saying!! :)

LilMatty Althouse: The freedonia sim which hosts the builders resources will have to move to Adult Verified as the Sim Onwer and dear friend a long time supporter, and a founder of the BRN feels that is best for her sim, however the conaequences of such a move means that only adult verified users will be able to access it.
Innula Zenovka: Because of content I and my tenants have elsewhere on the sim, unless LL change their mind and let me flag by parcel, I’ve no choice but to make the whole sim Adult

LilMatty Althouse: Right.

LilMatty Althouse: I guess because of this

LilMatty Althouse: we first need to kind of define exactly what adult verified means,

LilMatty Althouse: Adult Verification means, begin verified that you, the person behind the avatar, are indeed over theage of 18.

Master Quatro: do we have any choice .. LL is dictating that process

LilMatty Althouse: Let me finish typing :)

LilMatty Althouse: The original system set up for verification, was done in a way where you were required to send passport/personal information… however this from LL has since been revised.

LilMatty Althouse: Now anyone with payment info on file is a verified user.

LilMatty Althouse: As long as you have had an active credticard etc on your profile for the last I think it is year or so, you are not verified.

LilMatty Althouse: the way to see this is, if yuo open up your profile you will see a little square below the resurection date, of the avatar… if you see the words payment info on file. You are indeed verified!

Innula Zenovka: if you have used a credit card or paypal to buy lindens on slx or xlstreet, you should be OK

LilMatty Althouse: Thank you Innula, I forget now SLX is also owned by Linden Lab so should count now also.

Innula Zenovka: There have been some reports from people testing the 1.23 release candidate that the xlstreet verification isn’t working properly yet, but it’s certainly supposed to be good enough

LilMatty Althouse: However if you have no payment information on profile then you will have trouble accessing places like Freedonia, I expect that to be a minority of the group, as most builders here at one time or another have bought lindens to pay for texture uploads! However I would like to give you all this chance to voice any ideas you may have. About how to distribute content from the BRN to those un-verified, My current idae is to perhaps have newly added content temporarily hosted at other locations for people to get, but that will not work long term.

LilMatty Althouse: if you all have any other ideas would be glad to hear them!

Preostan Scribe: That would not constitute age verification . . . how does this accomplish LL’s goal of protecting the innocent from stumbling into Adult land?

LilMatty Althouse: Pre, LL has stated this is not to protect the innocent but more to seperate the content, but we will get into that discussion after clearing up exactly! how you all feel about the BRN having content hosted on an adult sim.

Darrin2101 Aeon: how about setting up a Booth at NCI?

Master Quatro: if the BRN itself has no adult content .. as defined by LL then why be on that sim

Innula Zenovka: Apart from access, there’s the problem that it won’t show up in search unless you have “adult” turned on in preferences

Connie Darcy: yes, do we NEED to be on ‘adult’ ground?

LilMatty Althouse: Innula owns the sim, the land is Donated Quatro :) the Builders Resource Network is a network of donated places here in SL by residents of which we host land.

Master Quatro: makes no sense to be labeled “adult” and create all these work-arounds

Preostan Scribe: But the Search isn’t tied to the sim, it’s tied to to the language in the ad.

Master Quatro: ok

Innula Zenovka: no, the search is tied to the sim.. I’ve checked that with Blondin Linden.. at least that’s the case at the moment

LilMatty Althouse: Innula has been kind enough to donate the land, and we have yet to have any other offers so movign is out of the question as we cannot afford it… as it stands the BRN itself actually doesn’t cover its own costs. so. Moving is out of the question. So do we need to be on adult land? No… but do have any other options at this current time… sadly no. So we will have to make do.

Innula Zenovka: I should perhaps say that I’m not planning on changing the content of the rest of the sim.. it’s just that I’m forced to change the flagging to keep the content I’ve had for the last year

Master Quatro: understand

Preostan Scribe: OK, then your saying if the location of the Search resides on an adult sim regardless of the ad’s content, it can only be presented to adult certified Av?

Trix Seetan: ne contents can be distributed as group gift. no need to enter the sim

Innula Zenovka: Also, i intend to keep a resource centre open anyway.. it’s more a question of it you want to continue to use it or not

Trix Seetan: new

Innula Zenovka: that is what Blondin Linden is saying at the moment, Prostan

LilMatty Althouse: Preo, at this current time, you cannot flag a single parcel on an adult sim as non adult, and that will msot likely not change.

LilMatty Althouse: at least not at this current time

LilMatty Althouse: So with that! Lets get more into an indepth discussion on why LL is making these changes. And any of you can correct me if I am wrong, as my information has come from talks with Linden Lab, rather than reading message boards and forums.

Kathyj Burner: I know what I have read in the Blog posts but thats about it

Amy Vyceratops: I… don’t like the idea of censorship in general, that’s my opinion

LilMatty Althouse: A lot has changed since the first announcement, and I think personally, overall this is a good change but do note, that is my personal opinion. The seperation of adult and non adult content is less to do with protection of the innocent, and more to do with setting it up so that those coming into SL for adult related themes can get to where they are going with little trouble, those coming into SL for PG things can find it easier, to seperate content so that if you host a conference in SL for lets say, IBM, you knwo your neighbour won’t be a strip club.

Amy Vyceratops: -> LOL <-

Amy Vyceratops: o I see

LilMatty Althouse: Al so the introduction of the adult content gives Linden Labs a chance to actually zone the content. Comerical, Residential, Non proffit and so on. How the zoning will actually go I cannot remember. :) but that is a very big plan.

Master Quatro: let’s not describe it as making it easier for adults to find adult content .. LL wants to attract more educational and business entities

Master Quatro: adult content is a negative for that market

Master Quatro: that’s it

Amy Vyceratops: yes, we don’t want people stripping at serious buisness meetings

Amy Vyceratops: lols

Master Quatro: if they want to attract more IBMs Universities etc .. then adult content must be hidden from them

LilMatty Althouse: I would not say thats just it M Q! I think the idea of zoning is a good idea also.

Kathyj Burner: but lol I dont see why that would happen anyway

Master Quatro: it’s a marketing strategy

LilMatty Althouse: and I knwo thel indens are very enthusiastic about it.

Master Quatro: and it makes sense for LL

Kathyj Burner: I dont see Adult content now unless I go look for it

AbaBrukh Aabye: but adult content is a very subjective concept

Master Quatro: they have to attract a different market to grow and pull in more serious revenue

Innula Zenovka: well, of course, it will be open to griefers to create throw-away alts and create what mischeif they like on Mature and PG sims.. one of the arguments in favour of making Freedonia Adult is that Linden Labs will make griefers go and annoy Mature and PG sims and leave me in peace

AbaBrukh Aabye: nudist clubs are concidered adult

Master Quatro: that is one big advantage .. no griefers ! lol.

LilMatty Althouse: I agree with Innula, one of the greatest advantages for private sim owners

LilMatty Althouse: and I know many of you here are

AbaBrukh Aabye: when in RL nudist clubs are family affairs

LilMatty Althouse: is that by flagging your sim as adult will make it harder to be subjected to griefer attacks

Amy Vyceratops: sorry, I dunno what a griefer is hehe

Amy Vyceratops: is that people who are bullies?

Master Quatro: wow Amy you are blessed

Ezra Rasmuson: :)

Amy Vyceratops: I is confused sowwy

Innula Zenovka: not necessarily, AbaBrukh.. I’ve been following the discussions in the forums quite closely and Blondin Linden seems to think that nudist clubs will be ok on mature sims, depending on how they are advertised and how people behave on them

Connie Darcy: griefing is the use of scripts and or prims do cause disruption

Connie Darcy: to* cause

LilMatty Althouse: and harassment! thank you connie! I was getting worried on how to define that one!

Amy Vyceratops: oh like causing lag with too many attachments?

Kathyj Burner: back

AbaBrukh Aabye: glad to hear it, Innula

LilMatty Althouse: no Amy :)

LilMatty Althouse: Griefers go out of there way.

Innula Zenovka: and since you get banned for doing that sort of thing, people who want to cause that sort of nuisance often create an avatar just for the day.

Amy Vyceratops: ah ok

LilMatty Althouse: thats there purpose for being in SL… to cause harm and destruction to others.

Amy Vyceratops: omg those jerks should be banned then

LilMatty Althouse: its hard to catch them when they have 100 accounts :)

Amy Vyceratops: oh

Darrin2101 Aeon: they often are but come back with a new account

Innula Zenovka: it’s the same mentality as people who write viruses, Amy

Amy Vyceratops: oh I get it hehe

Ezra Rasmuson: you won’t find much argument with that Amy

Amy Vyceratops: thx for explainin

LilMatty Althouse: griefer (grief player) – (n) a player whose purpose is to cause grief. They can often be countered by muting them. But, if they persist or begin to escalate, then they should be reported to Linden staff.

Darrin2101 Aeon: they often hangout at sandboxes and infohubs

Amy Vyceratops: oh noes! I scared

LilMatty Althouse: However sadly now since LL opened up the ability to create many accounts, rather fast with little effort, and allowing multiple accounts tobe tied to one email address, its rather hard to just ban them…

Amy Vyceratops: ban the email account?

LilMatty Althouse: So one advantage of private sim owners going adult, is the avoidance of such grifer attacks as tying age verification to 100 accounts, is impossible under the current system.

Kathyj Burner: yes but then they would just make another email account

Connie Darcy: its not difficult to have many email accounts

Kathyj Burner: yes I see that

Amy Vyceratops: oops

Master Quatro: .. and griefers don’t want to waste time veryfuing accounts that they keep for a day or 2

LilMatty Althouse: I have 26 email address for different things and games.

Darrin2101 Aeon: should get the ip address and LL report them to their ISP

Amy Vyceratops: yes

Amy Vyceratops: better idea

LilMatty Althouse: Another advantage of becoming an adult sim for a private sim owner

LilMatty Althouse: is also the freedom of worry.

Kathyj Burner: yes and if they do age verifify couldnt LL tie the ban to thier age info?

LilMatty Althouse: This is especially for Sim renters who do not know the people renting their sim on a friend level.

Connie Darcy: i hadnt thought of this angle at all

Connie Darcy: big plus

Innula Zenovka: yeah.. the owner is held responsible for what goes on on the sim, so if someone tps in and takes exception to what one of my tenants is doing in his garden, then it’s me who gets into trouble with Linden Labs, and that’s a worry i don’t need

LilMatty Althouse: And to add on to Kathy just said, I also believe age verified users who are banned will not be able to repeat age verify with the same data, meaning that if someone is banned from adult continent.

LilMatty Althouse: They really will be banned

Darrin2101 Aeon: good

Trix Seetan: thats cool, but i think at all people who rent a plot for theyr shop. they will see theyr customer reduced to half cause customer cant enter the shop…im true?

Preostan Scribe: Now Kathy said age verify. . . are we even attempting to age verify or is it only payment info on record regardless of age?

Master Quatro: definitely

Innula Zenovka: can’t enter the sim.. or see it advertised

Debina DeSantis: It will have an impact for sure

Innula Zenovka: though there is the problem that a lot of content that can perfectly well be sold on mature sims can’t well be advertised

Trix Seetan: and all this only for not to have griefers? it sounds strange to me

Amy Vyceratops: but, I thought u had to be over 18 to join SL anyway

Innula Zenovka: there’s nothing wrong with selling, for example, Gorean Slave Silks on a mature sim, but you can’t use “Gor” or “Slave” in the advertising

Trix Seetan: prices of non adult sims will rise alot…..

Kathyj Burner: yes Amy thats what has me confused about this Adults should be expected to censor themselves

Innula Zenovka: yes, Amy .. that has been pointed out to Linden Labs, but they don’t see the force of the argument

Wim Pippen: whole SL is adult 18+, whats the problem

Amy Vyceratops: yes, I am confused

Kathyj Burner: if you dont want to see certain content dont search for it

Amy Vyceratops: yes

Preostan Scribe: They are attempting to create a red light district. . .

Kathyj Burner sighs

Innula Zenovka: a red light continent, in fact.. all adult mainland content will have to move there

Amy Vyceratops: omg

Amy Vyceratops: I don’t like this idea

Wim Pippen: beter make a 3e life then haha

Trix Seetan: this could be ok if lindens allow us to flag any plot as we want. we should make a petition abot that

Amy Vyceratops: segragation is bad

AbaBrukh Aabye: neither do I

LilMatty Althouse: I understand that one to Sim, Amy, Kathy. However.. from a private sim owner point of view, this will offer more options to manage the sim and do with it as you wish, as for the ‘red light district’ idea…. I am not sure if thats going to be so true… I do want to point out, that MANY fashion stores despite having no adult content have already asked LL to be relocated and given there just reason for why… and some of them have been accepted… and I am sure many more stoers will cross over to the adult grid despite not having adult content in them at all.

Wim Pippen: all the people who dont have payment, will be in trouble

Amy Vyceratops: what’s next? segragating the furries from the humanoids?

Master Quatro: they want to expand their market .. and adult content does not fit with corporate market or educational

Innula Zenovka: well, lots of us have been pleading with them to let us flag by parcel.. which would solve the problem with the BRN at Freedonia.. but they won’t at the moment

Preostan Scribe: But – the fact is that last I read, they are going to prevent you from deciding you want to go to this continent. Who and what goes is entirely up to the LL nannies. They don’t want everybody calling themselves Adult.

LilMatty Althouse: not true preo

LilMatty Althouse: that was only true with the relocation sceheme

Wim Pippen: give adult parcels another color

LilMatty Althouse: LL for a short time was offering free land transfers.

Innula Zenovka: Yes, Master.. but if I were a rl business or educational establisment, i would be thinking in terms of buying my own region anyway

Wim Pippen: we are all adults, and we choose by ourself

LilMatty Althouse: Thats the point behind varification, we will have a choice.

Trix Seetan: it seems lindens dont think we are able to choose….

LilMatty Althouse: we can choose to verify or not.

Innula Zenovka: Matty’s right.. anyone can move there.. it’s just LL decide if you get a free (and compulsorary) move from the mainland

Wim Pippen: how you will verify everyone?

Master Quatro: I agree Innula :-)

Kathyj Burner: I allready did with all 3 of my alts

Amy Vyceratops: how?

Master Quatro: I’m just telling you how LL thinks .. they are very simple people .. logic frequntly escapes them ..

LilMatty Althouse: To verify you just need payment information on your profile,

Wim Pippen: there are houses where more fam lives, with same IP adres

Amy Vyceratops: I already have it, so I am verified?

LilMatty Althouse: or you can verify without a creditcard, via your pass port or other identification.

LilMatty Althouse: Yes amy

LilMatty Althouse: you are verified :)

Amy Vyceratops: yaay

Preostan Scribe: So why not create a PG continent instead, one where the Corporate and Educational world can feel at peace?

Ezra Rasmuson: well the logic of ehat’s good or what they think is good for the business entity of LL is the driving force behind this

Wim Pippen: a child can use his parent for example

Amy Vyceratops: yes Pro, it was what I was thinking

Master Quatro: LL is the most autocratic company I have ever encountered .. they manage by edict .. run forums to appease and still do the illogical .. simply because they can

Innula Zenovka: the test is if you can tp to this place http://slurl.com/secondlife/Arapaima/131/170/22 Amy (don ‘t try now.. I’ll give you a LM)

Master Quatro: don’t try to inject logic into their reasoning

Amy Vyceratops: why not try now?

Master Quatro: you’ll be frustrated

Ezra Rasmuson: I agree

Kathyj Burner: yes the pg continent seems to make more sense lol

Ezra Rasmuson: it’s just business for them

Innula Zenovka: cos you’ll miss the meeting

Kathyj Burner: and yes Master I understand what you are saying

Amy Vyceratops: k

LilMatty Althouse: being on PG land will not be viable for many many mature companies

Innula Zenovka just had visions of everyone clicking the slurl and vanishing and Matty getting mad with me

Amy Vyceratops: hehe

Kathyj Burner: haha

Wim Pippen: haha

Kathyj Burner: well then a cooperate continent

Ezra Rasmuson: :)

Kathyj Burner: lol

Master Quatro: Facebook does very well with mixes content .. mixed age groups .. mixed nationalities ..

Ezra Rasmuson: I’m guessing that there will be a major rush to the adult areas leaving the others pretty quite

suzan Tracy: ;)

Amy Vyceratops: hehe

Master Quatro: ues .. an educational continent .. a corporate continent .. great ideas

Ezra Rasmuson: so IBM should have a lot of room

LilMatty Althouse: Ezra, I believe the Lindens are actually hoping to remove some sims from this mainland if possible.

Master Quatro: would solve the problem ..

Master Quatro: leave the rest alone

Amy Vyceratops: yes

Wim Pippen: no one wil visit then IBM

LilMatty Althouse: I do want to bring up something

LilMatty Althouse: which is also of great importance to remember.

Master Quatro: IBM doesn’t want to be visited

Amy Vyceratops: we should all dance naked in front of the IMB people -> LOL <- jk

Master Quatro: they want to use it for corporate meetings etc

Preostan Scribe: Ezra, and thats exactly what LL’s is trying to avoid. most would just call themselves Adult instead of mature, like now most are mature when the could be PG.

Wim Pippen: haha

Master Quatro: employee stuff

AbaBrukh Aabye: I’m with you Amy :)

LilMatty Althouse: there are many real life adult oriented companies which are in Second Life. Who need the adult content warning for Real life legal reasons.

Amy Vyceratops: :P

Innula Zenovka: except that an Adult flag will — many people fear — cause big problems for traffic.. your adverts won’t be visible

LilMatty Althouse: so also the Adult verification caters to this group of Business that LL has for a long time had trouble with.

Amy Vyceratops: OMG I wanna dance naked in front of IMB people in RL now!

AbaBrukh Aabye: hehehe

AbaBrukh Aabye: I’m with ya :)

suzan Tracy: lol Amy
Darrin2101 Aeon: bye all

Trix Seetan: bye

Amy Vyceratops: byes

Master Quatro: IBM may own SL soon .. there is also the reasoning that LL needs to sell SL so the original investors .. venture capital people can get their payout

Amy Vyceratops: omg!

Amy Vyceratops: they’ll ruin EVERYTHING!

Wim Pippen: own?

Master Quatro: they are making SL more attractive for an ultimate buyer

Kathyj Burner: so I have a question that has probably already been answered if so please IM me what about what goes on in private residences regardless of classification?

Wim Pippen: that will be the end of SL

Master Quatro: I habve never heard of a start-up with venture capital lasting over 5 years

Ezra Rasmuson: good question

Master Quatro: SL is long overdue to be sold

Preostan Scribe: What they are doing is making an open grid more viable as they destroy this one.

Amy Vyceratops: Chocobo!

Master Quatro: good point Pre

Amy Vyceratops: oops sorry

LilMatty Althouse: Private residences on mainland should still be fine, however if in full public view that may be another question. The area is very very vague, even now.

Wim Pippen: lol

LilMatty Althouse: It mainly depends on what you are doing within these residences.

Innula Zenovka: there’s a good run-down of the changes, plus links, at http://satiateddesires.wordpress.com/2009/04/29/second-life-adult-content-changes-how-theyll-affect-you/

Master Quatro: omg 75% of private residences i SL have sex animations

LilMatty Althouse: If lets say you are having sex on a residence facing a linden ocean sim, in full view at gronud level you may find yourself in trouble, if you were doing it 1000m in the air far out of the way, the chances are low.

Master Quatro: and that estimate may be low

Master Quatro: lol.

Kathyj Burner: well that what I am saying even for people who are partnered they have a right to express themselves with each other what happens to them

Master Quatro: for those exhibitionists .. you’re in trouble

LilMatty Althouse: Linden Labs are hoping residents will use their common sense.

Wim Pippen: what is a sex animations? who will tell what is and wich is not
Master Quatro: so I can’t have random sex ? I have to be partnered

Innula Zenovka: In general, so long as things are going on inside the house you’re ok.. parties that get out of hand may not be

Kathyj Burner: lol there is no completly private areas in sl anyone can cam anywhere just about

Preostan Scribe: now you start bringing up the question of personal custumns. Are we going to have to have our females wearing burka’s because some are offended?

Master Quatro: wow .. are we into heavy censorship

AbaBrukh Aabye: exactly

Wim Pippen: SL is one open room

Master Quatro: Preo

Amy Vyceratops: omg

Amy Vyceratops: omg

AbaBrukh Aabye: I hate this

Amy Vyceratops: yes

LilMatty Althouse: in terms of clothing again common sense.

LilMatty Althouse: if on pg/mature land

AbaBrukh Aabye: but who decides???

LilMatty Althouse: LL will act on a case by case situation.

AbaBrukh Aabye: in other words, the Thought Police

LilMatty Althouse: for the most part, clothing is fine.

Amy Vyceratops: omg

Wim Pippen: yess, dutch people will decide otherway then iran people

Trix Seetan: LL will have a police wondering around lurking us? how we dress, how we behave….this is weird

Wim Pippen: or american

Cynthia Darcy: i agree wim

Master Quatro: ultimately .. Obama will decide ..

Amy Vyceratops: oh noes

Innula Zenovka: As to your advertising, the SL content filters decide.. otherwise if someone takes exception to something they can complain and the Governance Team, i think it’s called, will do whatever it is they do

LilMatty Althouse: but if you are wearing gorean wilks at a place for, lets so… education for disease prevention. You may get questions :)

Amy Vyceratops: hehe

LilMatty Althouse: people please stay on topic.

LilMatty Althouse: many of us are from many nations so try not to mention countries etcc :)

Master Quatro: ciao suzan

LilMatty Althouse: But back on topic of clothing and age verification.

LilMatty Althouse: Igt is still very vague, it will be done on a case by case situation, on the adult grid, do what you wish… on the pg grid however, go about how you would in real life, don’t wear gorean silks to a conference on drug abuse prevention, or a bikini to an award ceremony :) In truth its not that bad

LilMatty Althouse: the question is
LilMatty Althouse: if your age verified and your not in SL for the pg/mature things.
LilMatty Althouse: will you even notice or care as you won’t be on that part of SL?

LilMatty Althouse: and if you are here for the non adult things… will you even care to much? as your not in SL for that….

Connie Darcy: perhaps, when someone mentions for example the texture market to you, and you cant go because its on an adult sim?

Trix Seetan: i dont care of adult contents, but i care of freedom

Innula Zenovka: that is precisely the problem, I think, Connie

LilMatty Althouse: thats something the owners of places such as the texture market of freedonia have to decide connie.

Amy Vyceratops: exactly, they are taking away our freedom of expression

LilMatty Althouse: but trix you have the freedom of choice to verify or not. That is upto you.

Trix Seetan: this is a out out, not a free choise. imho, of course :)

Master Quatro: it will all come down to only adult content on adult sims .. nothing else

Master Quatro: if you want to stay in business

Master Quatro: so if you have a texture business you better have it on a non-adult sim

Connie Darcy: :-(

LilMatty Althouse: Connie with what you said… that is the biggest problem that I think is being faced, and the owners of such places will have to deal with those…

Master Quatro: that’s what it means to me

Innula Zenovka: I disagree, Master.. the businesses in which I’m involved (as a scritper) want to stay on Mature land as much as possible.. because of the traffic and advertising

Connie Darcy: if i cant advertize i may as well close

Master Quatro: yes Innula .. then you’ll be limited to the adult market if that’s controlled by LL

Innula Zenovka: we’re going, however, to have to have extra stores on adult land so we can advertise some lines

Master Quatro: I didn’t think mature sims were affected

Innula Zenovka: so i think we’re going to end up with very mixed content

Master Quatro: not on adult sims if you don’t cater to adult trade

AbaBrukh Aabye: Master, it’s just not that simple

Innula Zenovka: it’s a question, very much, of how you describe a lot of things…

Master Quatro: we just determined thet the only reason the BRN is on an adult sim is because of free rent .. or else it would make no sense

LilMatty Althouse: Yes… I have already been offered many jobs of re-structuring advertisements as to be appropriate for mature sims.

LilMatty Althouse: Master its not free rent its donated land :)

Master Quatro: if i sell houses .. why would I ever be on an adult sim .. I have access to the entire SL population by being on a mature or PG sim

Innula Zenovka: there’s no particular reason, Blondin Linden has said — publicly — that Dari Caldwell’s BDSM shop shouldn’t be on a mature sim.. it’s just Dari will have problems advertising

LilMatty Althouse: I think therei s a big difference, in the two.

LilMatty Althouse: thats right innula

Master Quatro: for BRN it’s the same

LilMatty Althouse: its advertising and a search that will be more affected

Master Quatro: it’s free land

LilMatty Althouse: than businesses themselves.

LilMatty Althouse: in terms of location

Innula Zenovka: well, it’s a free resource centre that pre-dates the BRN, Master.. and because other people liked the idea, the BRN started

LilMatty Althouse: Hehe its the start of the BRN innula :)

Innula Zenovka: and it will remain there, on my present planning, whether or not it remains affiliated to the BRN

LilMatty Althouse: *remembers planning it and putting the idea to you and others* :)

Amy Vyceratops: k gotta runnow

LilMatty Althouse: well M Q, its only part of the BRN. The freedonia store. And its not just freeland, its more than the parcel can’t be flagged as not adult on an adult sim, than anything.

Innula Zenovka: i know. i remember too, Matty

Master Quatro: I understand perfectly .. was just using it as an example

LilMatty Althouse: Freedonia will either be with the BRN or outside of the BRN it will stay there, if more land is offered to us we will duplicate the store.

Connie Darcy: is there a list available from Linden Labs of adult only words, in relation to advertising?

LilMatty Althouse: but the place at freedonia will most likely remain

Kathyj Burner: yes I found it its quite a long list

LilMatty Althouse: No connie but I will do an article up using the Real World principles sometime in the next month.

LilMatty Althouse: oh they do kathy?

Innula Zenovka: yes. and if anyone wants to put out duplicates of stuff that I’ve put into the Freedonia place then, of course, I’ll be happy to help

Kathyj Burner: yes let me see if I can find it again

Ezra Rasmuson: I need to go too, thanks Matty and Innula. Bye everyone.

LilMatty Althouse: thank you Kathy, was not aware at all

LilMatty Althouse: goodbye Ezra thank you for coming

Master Quatro: me too .. gonna go visit Fredonia to get an idea

Debina DeSantis: take care :-))

Master Quatro: thank you for the invitations ..

Master Quatro: good discussion

LilMatty Althouse: no problem Master :)

Master Quatro: U understand a little better

Connie Darcy: will everyone have to rewrite their profiles, ads, picks & even items because they contain for example “sexy”, “sexy walk” or “sexy dress”?

LilMatty Althouse: I have found the list :)

Trix Seetan: im a bit puzzled. not sure to understand completley what all that will mean for our sl future

LilMatty Althouse: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Search_keywords

Innula Zenovka: there’s a list at http://www.slapt.me/wiki/index.php/Adult_Content_Keywords that has been compiled by residents, feeding words into the filters to see what passes and what doesn’t

LilMatty Althouse: I don’t think theres an actual list made public.

LilMatty Althouse: I think Connie, they may if they want them to show in a non adult search.

Innula Zenovka: my profile, i think, is — or will be — blocked from all but adult search unless i take out various words like “submissive” and “slave”

Innula Zenovka: that’s my understanding of it, certainly, after following the forum discussions

AbaBrukh Aabye: or nude pics

LilMatty Althouse: If you all wish for it

LilMatty Althouse: I will write up an article sometime this month about word use and advertising

Connie Darcy: ok… one thing – some search filters use whole words, some use part… which is SL?

LilMatty Althouse: to shwo a real life definition of Adult and Mature. Based on the New Zealand BSA

LilMatty Althouse: Broadcasting Standards Authority that is.

LilMatty Althouse: I am sure its not to far from most other countries.

Connie Darcy: thats a huge task matty

LilMatty Althouse: no connie not at all, :) I have text books here from when I studied.

LilMatty Althouse: and have worked in that industry before.

Preostan Scribe: and are all languages going to be censored? and all induendo?

Preostan Scribe: seems they are setting themselves up for a huge fail.

LilMatty Althouse: Probably just the main languages based on the different language viewers available

AbaBrukh Aabye: inuendo would certainly be impossible

Kathyj Burner: lol should have copied the url I will keep looking tho

Innula Zenovka: the filters seem to use whole words, according to the slapt wiki

Kathyj Burner: oh ok just read back in chat

Connie Darcy: i assume they will duplicate the same system in all languages they support, and assume you mean innuendo – which as mr Brukh said would not be possible

Connie Darcy: LL are currently working on widening support for several other languages & will have to do the same for them

Innula Zenovka: this language thing is going to be interesting.. there’s a French bdsm club on one sim i own, which will be Adult because of what goes on there, but I don’t think their description is going to trip the filters cos it’s all in French

LilMatty Althouse: Actually Innula, french is a very supported language by LL, as LL actually advertised for al ong time on TV in france.

LilMatty Althouse: which was interesting because LL usually don’t advertise at all.

Trix Seetan: i must go. thx for the infos. let know if there is something more, please :)

LilMatty Althouse: Thank you for coming Trix.

Trix Seetan: ty to you all :)

Preostan Scribe: So any attempt they make to ‘censor’ ad’s would be met with a suitable workaround. . . I think nows the time to investigate a Search Engine not controlled by SL. Maybe one that works even.

LilMatty Althouse: I am sure someone will come up with one Preo :)
Innula Zenovka: i know.. but what i’m saying is I don’t think — based on experiments last week, anyway — that they’ve asked anyone to compile a list of French words to filter .. at least not in the detail the English filters work

LilMatty Althouse: I think so also Innula.

Kathyj Burner: lol and I am wondering how many euphaisiams sp? people are going to come up with

Kathyj Burner: to work around the ads

Connie Darcy: reading that list seems like theyve not seriously worked on this yet

LilMatty Althouse: Well everyone! Thank you so much for coming! Its 5:33am now, I didn’t sleep to host this for you all! hehe

AbaBrukh Aabye: even if they try to use the same input, different languages put very different weights on equivalent words

Innula Zenovka: we have been encourages so to do, Kathyj —

Kathyj Burner: aww

Innula Zenovka: yes.. you go to bed, Matty.. get some sleep

AbaBrukh Aabye: what’s very nasty in English may bea mere bagatelle in French

AbaBrukh Aabye: :)

Innula Zenovka: thank you so much for organising this

Kathyj Burner: get some sleep Matty thanks so much

AbaBrukh Aabye: night, Matty – thanks!

Connie Darcy: did anyone log chat prior to my arrival?

LilMatty Althouse: feel free to continue without me :)

Cynthia Darcy: smile get some sleep matty you need it also

Preostan Scribe: i”m out as well. . and Connie, I think Matty will distrubute the chat log. .

Innula Zenovka: or even American vs British English.. there’s the sad case of the woman who can’t sell “my lovely little ass” (a quadruped) on xlstreet without flagging it as “mature”

Kathyj Burner: yep

Innula Zenovka: yes.. I’ve been logging it for Matty

Connie Darcy: ty
~~~

2 Responses to “Transcript: BRN Grid Discussion #2 – The future of our World – Adult Verification”

  1. […] You can find a transcript of the chat here! […]

  2. Innula Zenovka Says:

    Thanks so much for organizing the meeting, Matty, and to everyone who attended.

    One follow-up point on maturity settings and advertising, of which I wasn’t aware and which might be of interest — concern, even — to people wishing to advertise PG material.

    It’s not at all clear if this is intended behavior or a glitch that Linden Labs will sort out, but according to reports from people testing the Release Candidate, PG adverts for PG parcels on Mature sims only show up if you’ve chosen to view Mature material:

    “Yesterday a PG flagged ad consisting of nothing but the word “Apple” in both the name and description placed on a PG rated parcel in a mature rated region would be found in a mature search but not in a PG only search rofl.

    This leads me to suspect visibility was tied to parcel rating yesterday.

    Again I request Linden Lab tell us what the expected behavior is supposed to be so we can probe it for flaws and report them.”

    http://forums.secondlife.com/showpost.php?p=2414455&postcount=99

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